[English] Devs On Tape x Kscope23 - Almost Retirement Edition with Jonathan Dixon

00:00:16: Hello and welcome to another episode of Devs on Tape.

00:00:19: Today I have another very interesting guest I Kscope.

00:00:23: So he appeared almost immediately when I joined to the

00:00:27: conference and he appeared also.

00:00:30: on the same kind of explosion on social media a few months ago.

00:00:34: So please welcome with me today, Jonathan Dixon.

00:00:38: Hello, Jonathan.

00:00:39: Hey, Kai.

00:00:39: It's really great to be here.

00:00:40: Yes.

00:00:41: Awesome.

00:00:41: Glad I got you into this room here to talk to you for for this episode.

00:00:47: So yeah, I, I just, just yeah, started this or introduced this podcast with

00:00:52: mentioning that you just, Appeared on social media and you I mean, you got a

00:00:57: very, very high follower account already.

00:01:00: Just, just, just posting very interesting stuff.

00:01:03: Right.

00:01:04: Maybe we can get a step, step back and get a more in depth introdu

00:01:08: introduction of your life and career.

00:01:10: Absolutely.

00:01:11: Yeah.

00:01:11: I can, I can assure you it hasn't been just now I, I'm quite old , so

00:01:16: I started off in technology.

00:01:18: Probably 1994 back in the uk.

00:01:21: I worked for Oracle UK for four years or so doing actually Oracle e

00:01:26: r p implementations, doing you know, forms, reports, all that good stuff

00:01:30: back all the way back to forms 2.4.

00:01:34: I worked in the uk like I say, for about four years.

00:01:36: Got a chance to transfer over to the US about 2000 and continued to do E

00:01:44: E R P extension stuff for another.

00:01:46: 10, 15 years.

00:01:47: I got real lucky and then started getting involved in Oracle Fusion Cloud while I

00:01:52: was still working with Oracle Consulting.

00:01:54: So that gave me an opportunity to look into a bunch of new technologies because

00:01:58: EBS, you know, it's been pretty static technology wise since other than forms

00:02:03: going from character mode to GUI mode, there's not much else has changed.

00:02:08: So I got a chance to see, see more, more stuff in the Fusion Cloud and

00:02:12: get into more complex integrations, architecture, all that good stuff.

00:02:17: And then I left Oracle after 18 years, I was at Oracle total and I went to work

00:02:23: with a group of guys, a smaller company.

00:02:26: And that's where I got into Apex.

00:02:27: So they had just.

00:02:29: Heard about Apex themselves.

00:02:31: They would, they had hired me to do EBS extension still, the same old stuff.

00:02:35: I was, just happened to be, it was about a mile from where I lived and

00:02:38: I wanted to stop traveling at Oracle.

00:02:41: So they still, they got into Apex.

00:02:43: I was walking by somebody's desk one day and I saw somebody playing with Apex.

00:02:47: They didn't really know it too well, but I saw it.

00:02:49: I, nice.

00:02:51: Immediately sort of was drawn towards it, tried to learn a little bit about

00:02:54: it, where is it sitting, is it in the database, how does it all work?

00:02:58: And pretty quickly I made an association, well, a lot of our EBS customers, they had

00:03:04: EBS database, Oracle database with EBS.

00:03:07: You know, Apex was, you know, no additional fee for the database

00:03:10: and it gave me the opportunity to get a bit more creative.

00:03:14: Because in the ERP extension world, especially EBS, you know, doing Oracle

00:03:19: forms and reports, there's not much room for creativity or going outside of the box

00:03:24: or, you know, it's a very rigid structure for what you can do to extend an EBS

00:03:29: application or what you're supposed to do.

00:03:31: So we started playing around with using Apex to do extensions to EBS.

00:03:37: In many ways, it was a ton easier than having to be constrained by some of the

00:03:41: stuff you had to do in the EBS space.

00:03:44: And I just loved it.

00:03:45: I, I, I don't think I touched another formal report.

00:03:49: Maybe two months after that, I never touched another formal report.

00:03:52: Big time into Apex.

00:03:53: It was around 4.

00:03:54: 2, so relative latecomer.

00:03:56: compared to a lot of folks you meet, meet around.

00:03:59: Yeah.

00:03:59: I mean, I started at Apex 4.

00:04:01: 2, right?

00:04:02: So I was from the beginning using dynamic, dynamic actions.

00:04:06: So they were introduced with 4.

00:04:08: 2.

00:04:08: But this was, was not the point where you started to getting

00:04:11: active on social media, right?

00:04:12: Oh

00:04:12: no, we're still a long way from

00:04:14: that.

00:04:14: Yeah.

00:04:14: Were you, were you attending any, any community events or

00:04:17: did you participate in any way?

00:04:19: So

00:04:19: we.

00:04:20: I went to a case scope with that company I'm going to forget how long

00:04:23: ago that was, but it was in Seattle.

00:04:24: It was the earlier Seattle one.

00:04:26: So I've been to Seattle twice, but I was very under the radar.

00:04:29: I was still a very shy EBS extension guy.

00:04:33: So then I left that company two other guys and me created a

00:04:38: company that doing more Apex stuff.

00:04:40: I started, we started, we posted a little bit.

00:04:43: On Twitter and stuff like that.

00:04:44: I did write a bunch of blogs.

00:04:45: It was a company called JMJ Cloud.

00:04:47: You can see a bunch of my blogs out there, but we sort of advertised it as part of

00:04:52: the company as opposed to me personally.

00:04:55: And that's probably one of the regrets from back there that I

00:04:57: didn't make those blogs mine.

00:04:58: And I see a lot of people making that mistake and posting solely to that

00:05:02: company and they don't own that IP, right?

00:05:06: So then COVID came along we were real busy.

00:05:09: I was doing 60 hours plus a week.

00:05:11: We got.

00:05:13: My wife and I were moving from Texas to California at the same time.

00:05:17: We did the math and we figured we could retire.

00:05:19: Oh yeah.

00:05:20: So we went to California and I retired for about a month.

00:05:27: Sat on the beach for a month basically.

00:05:28: Didn't

00:05:29: do not too much.

00:05:30: I'm just trying to imagine how it would be to retire and be

00:05:33: in California at the beach.

00:05:36: Why did you come back?

00:05:38: Well, in sitting at the beach, you gotta know when the tide is low and

00:05:42: when the tide is high, because when the tide's high where we were, it

00:05:45: completely covered the whole beach, so you couldn't sit on the beach.

00:05:48: So, you know, having done a lot of APEX, I put together a little APEX

00:05:52: app and the NOAA organization in the US has web services to tell you

00:05:57: Exactly what the tide level is now and predictions for what it is in the future.

00:06:01: So I build an Apex app.

00:06:02: Of course.

00:06:03: And as I'm building it, I'm thinking, Wow, I'm really enjoying doing this.

00:06:07: So I finished that app up.

00:06:10: Still during COVID.

00:06:11: So my wife has a sister in back in Texas still and she's trying

00:06:15: to interact more with her niece.

00:06:17: who's about six or seven years old.

00:06:19: And so I built a tic tac toe game in Apex again for those guys to play and interact.

00:06:26: Again, loved it.

00:06:27: I thought, why am I not doing this more?

00:06:29: So then I started writing some blogs.

00:06:31: Still no work yet, but then that's where I found Hashnode and started doing a

00:06:36: whole bunch of blogs on that platform.

00:06:39: Then I started tweeting about it and just thought, you know, this is nice.

00:06:42: I'm enjoying doing it.

00:06:43: I was, Still learning and I think that's probably what I missed the

00:06:46: most from work before was still learning and keeping my brain active.

00:06:52: Then I reached out to a customer I'd worked with before in the UK just to

00:06:56: do a few hours a week just to get back into it and they were really open to it.

00:07:00: Doing that and I kept the blogs going and it was really just.

00:07:04: Right and consistent blogs that I put a lot of time and effort into to

00:07:08: get in them looking good and Being proud of and I started promoting them

00:07:13: more because I was proud of them.

00:07:14: That's a very very interesting point So how much time do you do

00:07:18: you invest in doing those community?

00:07:21: contributions

00:07:22: I'm going to say about eight to ten hours per blog, some, some, you know, some,

00:07:27: if I know this topic really well, I can sort of knock it out in maybe four or

00:07:31: five hours, but usually you never know a topic as well as you think you know it.

00:07:36: So I go to write about it and I, I'm I'm not a big Promoter of myself.

00:07:41: So it was the first few blogs that went out.

00:07:43: I was very concerned that I was going to get criticized and all that, or

00:07:47: people would say, well, that's not the right way to do it or whatever.

00:07:50: So I really researched and tried to make them perfect.

00:07:53: And over time, I've sort of dialed back, dialed that back a little bit.

00:07:58: But yeah, I would say on average eight to 10 hours, because there's

00:08:00: a two or three hours of doing a POC.

00:08:02: I always write code for every blog I do to make sure it does

00:08:06: what I say it's going to do.

00:08:09: Then just sort of knock out a draft and I might revisit it 10 or 15 times.

00:08:13: I I'll do a whole bunch, come back to it, tweak it, go away again, come back again.

00:08:19: And that's my method.

00:08:20: That

00:08:21: that's, that's quite an invest, right?

00:08:22: Yeah,

00:08:23: it really is.

00:08:24: But I, I get a huge amount out of it.

00:08:26: I mean, I, I really do enjoy

00:08:27: it.

00:08:27: I mean, you, you.

00:08:29: Did the right thing did the right thing to say Kai, yes, I'm coming to your podcast.

00:08:34: Everything is great.

00:08:35: So there's no, no critics on here who are going into your stuff because

00:08:39: I mean, what should they criticize?

00:08:41: We were talking about your career, right?

00:08:43: Yeah.

00:08:43: But yeah, so you, you created like Like an app I saw that in the open mic

00:08:47: night on the other night, and I was very happy to see that still people

00:08:52: are writing such great things in Apex.

00:08:55: So you often see like big data analytics applications and so on.

00:09:00: But there's still some room for games.

00:09:02: Absolutely.

00:09:02: I love that.

00:09:03: Yep.

00:09:03: Great.

00:09:04: So you got back into Apex development, right?

00:09:07: So you said a company was hiring you, that you are working for them.

00:09:11: Yep.

00:09:12: And you are back in the business and working for customers,

00:09:15: right?

00:09:15: Yes, I've got two customers right now, one in the UK, one in Canada.

00:09:19: Can't seem to find one in the U.

00:09:20: S., but that's...

00:09:21: Yeah,

00:09:22: of course.

00:09:22: I mean, today it's not necessary to be on the same boat, right?

00:09:25: And, are then the topics you are writing about in your blogs coming out

00:09:29: of those projects or do you just walk around and say, Hey, we should do talk

00:09:34: about petitioning right now, right?

00:09:37: Yeah, it's a bit of both.

00:09:38: So sometimes it's the new version of Apex and I, you know,

00:09:42: selfishly, I want to learn it.

00:09:43: And so while I'm learning it, I figure out, I'll share it and I learn it

00:09:47: better if it's going to be published.

00:09:49: Like I said, I do a lot of research, so I want to make sure

00:09:51: I know, right?

00:09:51: Yeah, it's a win win situation, right?

00:09:52: So everyone who is presenting at conferences doing exactly the same, right?

00:09:57: So I would submit an abstract.

00:10:00: It might be something I'm not, not already into.

00:10:04: And yeah, then you do the research, do your job, and then you're...

00:10:08: Getting an expert in it.

00:10:09: So if I imagine I'm writing so many blog posts as you do, there must be

00:10:14: a big bunch of knowledge in, in, in the, in a very short amount of time.

00:10:19: Yeah.

00:10:19: I can say about half are things I'm wanting to learn or pick up on,

00:10:23: but half are based on experience and stuff that I've done before.

00:10:26: In fact, one of my customers says, I'm really glad you do all that

00:10:30: because I get the advantage of that knowledge without having to pay for it.

00:10:34: Essentially, because I already know it going into doing that.

00:10:38: Yeah.

00:10:38: And so you became an Oracle ace again, right?

00:10:41: So you were not before, obviously, because you didn't share that much

00:10:45: content besides the company block.

00:10:47: And then it right quick, rightly right, right.

00:10:51: Very quick that you got in the ace program, right?

00:10:54: Yeah.

00:10:55: It's, it's, it's something I actually looked at maybe four years ago and, and I.

00:11:00: I wasn't that keen on it at the time for whatever reason I didn't pursue

00:11:04: it like we were doing some blogs on a company site but when I looked at it

00:11:09: again a year or so ago it seemed like it was more energised I think they

00:11:13: released the program re energised the program and I liked what What they were

00:11:18: trying to do with it and I want, and I, I wanted to get some recognition

00:11:23: as well because it's not all selfless giving out blogs to the community.

00:11:28: It is nice to have a little pat on the back every so often.

00:11:30: And so I applied myself.

00:11:32: I, I didn't feel like I could reach out to somebody else to ask them.

00:11:36: It's just my mindset.

00:11:38: But I listed out all my blogs and, and all the stuff I'd done before some

00:11:42: of the stuff I'd done before as well.

00:11:44: And I was fortunate enough to get accepted.

00:11:46: Yeah.

00:11:46: Yeah, very proud of it.

00:11:48: I'm sure it will not take that long to see another ace pro.

00:11:53: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:11:55: I was you know, the points are based on blogs.

00:11:57: So I'm watching those points.

00:11:58: And I think I was three times over the number of points

00:12:00: last year because of that.

00:12:02: I mean, it does.

00:12:03: So.

00:12:03: So we are talking about the Oracle Ace program.

00:12:05: So this, this might be something new for some of the, of our listeners.

00:12:10: So maybe just I'm doing a short wrap up about the Oracle Ace program.

00:12:14: So basically you have to be nominated or you nominate, nominate yourself.

00:12:18: It's possible in the entry level.

00:12:21: And then you listen.

00:12:22: Your contributions.

00:12:23: Mm-hmm.

00:12:23: you did for the community.

00:12:25: There are certain rules you have to follow that those contributions are your own and

00:12:29: not in the company context, for example.

00:12:31: And then you're getting points for that.

00:12:33: So right after you got the nomination done and you were accepted, you're

00:12:36: getting an ACE associate right after you are an ACE associate, you are following

00:12:41: some contribution rules and you got almost everything rated or not rated.

00:12:45: You get points for whatever thing you are contributing to the community.

00:12:49: This could be presentations that could, that's this could be podcasting.

00:12:52: This could be blog article, book writings webinars, a big

00:12:57: list of things you can do then.

00:12:59: And then you have the possibility to just raise another level, right?

00:13:03: So from ace associate to ace pro and then to ace director.

00:13:06: And you're collecting the points and there are certain rules that have to be

00:13:11: followed that you can reach another level.

00:13:14: So what break my neck was the time I am ace pro because I not ace pro,

00:13:19: ace associate, because I went out of the program when my daughter was

00:13:23: born three and a half years ago.

00:13:25: And I got an Oracle alumni as alumni back then it was called alumni.

00:13:30: And then all points were frozen and I was a froze the alumni, I think because

00:13:35: I, I would have been a normal ace, which is now a ace pro and Yeah, means I

00:13:42: went out of the program, came back, was nominated again, got the associate, but

00:13:47: at like double time points for a director already and had everything in place,

00:13:53: but the duration of being an associate.

00:13:56: It's not long enough and the duration from an earlier promotion to pro, which

00:14:01: happened in August is not, is not long enough for now to, to have this upgrade

00:14:07: after this current evaluation phase.

00:14:09: So we are watching and we're collecting points again, and I don't really

00:14:13: know when you were promoted to ace you're an ace associate right now.

00:14:20: I don't confess to know the program inside out, but I submitted myself as an ace pro.

00:14:25: I don't think you can submit yourself as a director, but you

00:14:28: can submit the form as a pro.

00:14:29: I wasn't expecting to get it.

00:14:32: But like I said, I had blog posts spanning a number of years, even

00:14:35: though they're a company site and I had done, I presented at open

00:14:39: world once on odds and I presented.

00:14:42: Two other times at Kscope in previous years.

00:14:44: Like I said, I was under the radar then, so people didn't know me from now.

00:14:50: So I had some history of stuff to say that I had been contributing

00:14:55: previously.

00:14:56: That's great.

00:14:56: So you ended as an ace pro.

00:14:58: That's cool.

00:14:59: Yeah.

00:14:59: So Yeah.

00:15:00: Keep contributing.

00:15:01: I'm looking forward to see another director in front of me in the future.

00:15:05: But I'm very interested in this, this switch.

00:15:08: So I'm, I'm not into, I didn't understand yet.

00:15:12: When did this switch in your mind happen that you are now, okay, now

00:15:17: I'm contributing to nearly everything.

00:15:19: And now I'm out, out coming right.

00:15:21: Not under the radar, but now I'm confident enough to just share whatever it is.

00:15:26: It's weird.

00:15:27: I'm not convinced.

00:15:28: I know the answer to that question.

00:15:29: Okay.

00:15:30: It definitely had to do with the retirement and everything.

00:15:32: Cause like I said, everything got a bit overwhelming with

00:15:35: moving and COVID and everything.

00:15:36: So I sort of got out of the game and just having time to reflect and think

00:15:41: and back over my career and realize that.

00:15:44: Yeah, I've done some stuff that's worth sharing.

00:15:46: And I just got over that hump.

00:15:48: Like I said, I was, up until that point, I was always reticent to, to publish stuff

00:15:54: because I wasn't sure what other people were thinking, because I go to, I've been

00:15:58: to Kscope a few times and I'd see all these guys that You know, knew their stuff

00:16:01: and I'd be sort of wide eyed and, and still do like a whole bunch of people have

00:16:05: walked up to me this week and talk to me.

00:16:07: And I said, why is he talking to me?

00:16:10: It's, it's weird.

00:16:11: I'm just sort of getting used

00:16:12: to it.

00:16:13: I heard that very often from, from fresh and new speakers that

00:16:16: are active in the community.

00:16:17: Right.

00:16:18: So I brought a colleague of mine to the conference and that's

00:16:21: the first time he met you.

00:16:22: Right.

00:16:22: So, and he was saying, Jonathan Dixon is here.

00:16:25: I said, yes, the first time I saw him too, and, and I was just

00:16:28: curious because I didn't know where you are coming from and why.

00:16:32: So like you see kind of like I'm kind of a journey when someone enters the community.

00:16:38: So by the way, it's the best community you could have joined in because you

00:16:41: see so many great people and they are grateful for what you're doing.

00:16:44: Right.

00:16:44: But, the journey is starting at some point then they are starting doing

00:16:47: presentations getting better and better and do more and more stuff and

00:16:51: it was like instantly johnson dixon is on the screen and that's it right.

00:16:56: I think that the 20 odd years that went before that had a lot to do

00:17:00: with it because I in a consulting environment you know I was with

00:17:03: Oracle consulting for 18 years.

00:17:04: I was super confident.

00:17:05: I could go to a client, tell them what they needed to do, be very comfortable

00:17:10: in my, my own skin and, and, and communicating what I think needed to be

00:17:14: done and be clear and passionate about it.

00:17:18: It was just sharing that with the outside world that took a bit of getting used to.

00:17:22: And that was, I think, retiring, taking a complete stop, reevaluating, and

00:17:29: then saying, well, I do know stuff.

00:17:30: I've.

00:17:31: proven I know stuff and now I'm going to start

00:17:33: sharing it.

00:17:34: And it's getting better and better, right?

00:17:36: So if you, if you see how grateful the people are and you do it here in person,

00:17:40: because when you're doing a presentation or when you're just being there and

00:17:43: answer questions here in America, you're really, really seeing the gratefulness

00:17:48: of the people saying, I'm following you.

00:17:50: And for example, that I, I used this blog post to solve an issue at a customer

00:17:55: side, and this was extraordinary for me that I, I just get the the, the ABO

00:18:01: on your blog rights, the subscription.

00:18:04: Yeah, pretty, pretty cool.

00:18:06: And thank you for contributing on this thing.

00:18:07: So yeah.

00:18:08: What, what are you doing on the conference here in case code 23?

00:18:12: So I've

00:18:13: done two presentations so far.

00:18:16: I did one presentation on building faster REST services with AUDs, and I guess

00:18:21: I'm not even sure what day it is today, but that was on Monday, and then this

00:18:25: morning I did one on integrating Office 365 services with APEX, because I have

00:18:30: a bunch of customers who wanted them.

00:18:31: Thank you.

00:18:31: Do that kind of stuff.

00:18:32: And I've done it a few times.

00:18:33: So that was one of the ones where I drew on knowledge from actual implementations.

00:18:39: And then I was super fortunate to be on the ACE panel today at lunchtime,

00:18:43: again, super nervous, never done anything like it before in my life, but

00:18:47: I was up there with some great guys and they really made me feel comfortable.

00:18:51: And, and like I say, the community is so friendly.

00:18:53: So, so in approachable, it was, it was

00:18:56: awesome.

00:18:57: And now you have like, like a better picture of who's following you, right?

00:19:01: Yes.

00:19:01: You see the people.

00:19:02: Yeah.

00:19:02: You have a, you have a great feeling sitting there answering questions and

00:19:06: you see the gratefulness again from the people sitting in the audience.

00:19:09: Exactly.

00:19:09: The next time when you're publishing or contributing something to

00:19:12: the community, you know who the people are you're contributing to.

00:19:15: And now you know that in Europe, it's almost the same.

00:19:18: So inside the company I'm working for, Jonathan Dixon is a name, right?

00:19:22: Because they said, I don't know where they where he's coming from,

00:19:26: but I like the blog posts and so on.

00:19:28: So very widespread, exactly the thing.

00:19:32: What do you think is the mystery or the big tip to be such a successful social

00:19:39: media I would just say not startup now.

00:19:43: like starting social media and being like successful from minute one.

00:19:47: Yeah.

00:19:48: It was funny cause I had 37 Twitter followers a year ago

00:19:52: now it's 1100 or whatever.

00:19:56: For me, I did a bit of reading on, on blogging and not, not

00:19:59: too much, but I did a few hours of research and it seemed like.

00:20:03: Quality and consistency.

00:20:05: And it's the same in your career or anything else you do really.

00:20:08: It's quality and consistency.

00:20:10: So if you do something really well, and it's clear that you enjoy what you do,

00:20:14: because it comes across in what you do.

00:20:17: So if you write something that you enjoy writing about, and just being consistent.

00:20:22: So I, you know, committed to doing I'm now committed to doing,

00:20:24: I think, three blogs a month.

00:20:26: And people expecting to see that, they know that the blog

00:20:29: post is going to be coming out.

00:20:31: It's a bit daunting to begin with, knowing you've got to create that

00:20:35: content, but like I say, I love doing it.

00:20:37: So that, that's the biggest thing I think is that I really enjoy doing it.

00:20:41: Great.

00:20:41: Do you plan to expand the, the contributions in the social media

00:20:46: world a little bit more like dancing on TikTok or something like that?

00:20:51: It's, it's

00:20:51: funny.

00:20:51: I've, I'm a big fan of Conor McDonald the things he does.

00:20:56: definitely wouldn't go, you know, I'm not extrovert enough to do that kind of thing.

00:21:01: And I really liked that, that show that Anton does on a Friday, that YouTube show.

00:21:05: So I'm intrigued to think about something like that.

00:21:08: Still haven't figured out the right, the right thing to do

00:21:11: yet.

00:21:11: I mean, the first step.

00:21:13: Could be just to reach out to those shows and be present at this shows, right?

00:21:18: That's a great idea.

00:21:19: Because, I mean, you're a guest at Depths on Tape.

00:21:22: It is maybe not comparable with like, like the, the Anton show there.

00:21:27: I call it Anton show.

00:21:29: But I mean, to be guest there and to see what's maybe missing at such a format.

00:21:34: And yeah, I mean, Connor McDonald, we had them we had him in the podcast last year

00:21:39: and he was talking about exactly what he is doing and there's so much time in it.

00:21:43: And I don't think that in a normal life, like, I mean, maybe you retire again, just

00:21:48: to focus, just to focus on social media activeness, but yeah, so almost like.

00:21:53: A thousand and a couple followers in one year is quite a good thing.

00:21:58: When you, when you see that the community we are in is not that big

00:22:02: as like influencers are reaching way higher scores and followers, but in this

00:22:07: bubble where we are working in, it's quite a, quite a neat number, I think.

00:22:12: Yeah.

00:22:12: So did you prepare blog posts for the time being here in at KSCO?

00:22:17: Right.

00:22:17: I've all

00:22:18: scheduled or something.

00:22:18: I'll tell you a secret.

00:22:19: I've got.

00:22:20: About eight blog posts in draft mode at any one time.

00:22:23: I get anxious when I have less than five blog posts ready to post.

00:22:27: So I've got blog posts ready to go.

00:22:30: I haven't, I've seen a whole bunch of stuff this week that

00:22:32: I want to go and look at.

00:22:33: Like I just saw something on WebSockets and knew nothing about WebSockets.

00:22:36: So I'm going to go try and figure that out.

00:22:40: Next week, I guess.

00:22:41: So yeah, I'm always getting ideas for stuff.

00:22:44: So it's

00:22:45: fascinating.

00:22:45: So let's, let's hope that, that your need for new information will never end.

00:22:50: Right.

00:22:51: Okay.

00:22:51: So your plans for retirement are gone.

00:22:54: Yes.

00:22:54: So you want to stay, stay in the business for at least like.

00:22:58: Yeah,

00:22:59: probably till I keel over.

00:23:00: Yeah.

00:23:00: It's like I say, there was a bit of a panic moment for a

00:23:04: couple of months and then it.

00:23:06: I love it so much.

00:23:07: I would, I'm going to make sure I'm never going to get that far, you know, do that

00:23:12: many hours a week anymore because that was a, that was a part of the problem.

00:23:15: And I, and I'm very conscious that I'm not going to do that again.

00:23:19: Yeah.

00:23:19: But I, I, like I say, I love, even with customers, I love

00:23:23: the feeling of helping people.

00:23:24: Obviously a benefit getting paid for doing that, but that, that.

00:23:29: that sort of gives me life if you like to, to, to get that feeling.

00:23:32: So are you working like full time right now or do you do some kind of

00:23:36: reduced hours so you can cover the time you are contributing stuff?

00:23:41: Yeah, I'm doing, doing less than 40.

00:23:43: So I, I've got two customers at the moment.

00:23:45: I'm very fortunate that they sort of understand that situation.

00:23:49: And they've worked with me and They still like working with me

00:23:53: and doing that number of hours.

00:23:55: Because a lot of times people just need help here and there.

00:23:58: That's not necessary always.

00:24:00: Like in my ERP days, I did a two year project here and a two year project there.

00:24:04: But in the Apex world, it's, we're lucky because it could be a month long

00:24:08: project here and a two day project there.

00:24:11: So yeah, working in the apex world really helps with keeping it down.

00:24:15: Fortunate that my wife works as well.

00:24:17: So financially I can do this.

00:24:21: So that's great.

00:24:22: Yeah.

00:24:23: If I could amend it, like, like just.

00:24:25: Working for fun.

00:24:27: Reduce hours in California.

00:24:29: Yeah, I don't want to sound jealous right now.

00:24:33: But yeah, we are again, very grateful that you're attending or that

00:24:37: you're contributing your knowledge.

00:24:38: And yeah, very, very great to hear that it can avoid.

00:24:44: from going into the retirement that it's, I mean, you

00:24:48: couldn't do the reforms, right?

00:24:49: No, exactly.

00:24:50: Yeah.

00:24:50: I couldn't have built that forms app to show when the tide levels

00:24:53: were, it wouldn't have worked out.

00:24:54: Yeah.

00:24:55: Great.

00:24:55: So you talked about your presentations that you're doing here at Kscope.

00:24:58: Will you publish them on, on your platform?

00:25:01: So everyone from yeah, our listeners, maybe you can access them.

00:25:05: Yep.

00:25:05: I've already published them on Twitter and LinkedIn.

00:25:08: The both of the presentations are based on blogs I've done.

00:25:12: The ref, the blog links are in the presentations that I tweeted.

00:25:15: So it's yeah, I'm just really expanding on principles that

00:25:18: I have blogged about before.

00:25:20: Yeah.

00:25:20: So it's, yeah.

00:25:21: And then.

00:25:22: Obviously, if anybody sees anything and they have any

00:25:24: questions, I'm, I'm open to, to go.

00:25:26: Great.

00:25:26: So I will put those links to the mentioned presentations in the show notes so our

00:25:31: listeners can access them really easy.

00:25:35: All right.

00:25:35: So what are your plans still for the conference now?

00:25:38: So you had one two talks today.

00:25:40: We will share the ACE dinner together, but what are the plans

00:25:43: for the rest of the conference?

00:25:44: Do you have still more talks to visit beside the web socket?

00:25:47: I, I don't remember what my schedule is for tomorrow, but I'm

00:25:50: definitely looking to learn more.

00:25:52: And most of the time I'm at conferences like this, I'm just trying to think

00:25:56: of like the WebSocket thing I saw.

00:25:59: I saw Philip did a presentation on offline and I'm going to see yours

00:26:03: tomorrow as well and see which way is the best way to do that.

00:26:07: I thought this podcast is not self marketing, so I'm glad you're saying that.

00:26:12: So yeah, those kind of things.

00:26:14: And I might not.

00:26:16: Go out and do that, but you get pieces from these ideas that

00:26:19: you can, can then leverage.

00:26:21: And that, that's what I get out of it.

00:26:23: Anyway, it's like Philip's presentation.

00:26:25: I just saw, I thought, well, like I don't have a use case for the

00:26:28: whole thing, but I could see where I could store something locally

00:26:32: and do, and do something with that.

00:26:34: So it definitely gives me inspiration to then think about.

00:26:37: And that's, I think this is a spirit.

00:26:39: So from personally, when I, when I have to answer this question.

00:26:43: From this conference or from almost every conference, I have

00:26:46: like kind of a inspiration.

00:26:48: I'm, I'm taking out of the conference and when I'm heading

00:26:51: home, I have like a thousand ideas.

00:26:53: So that's what my colleagues are saying the same.

00:26:56: We are mirror mirroring our ideas.

00:27:01: If you compare that to being at home during COVID and you have like zero

00:27:06: inspiration, you don't have the energy or you don't have the spirit to not

00:27:11: the spirit you're saying in America.

00:27:13: You don't have that tension that.

00:27:16: You want to do something new and you want to yeah, evolve your stuff.

00:27:19: Right.

00:27:20: And when you're going back from a conference, especially from case

00:27:23: scope, you have a whole bunch of ideas and inspirations and you

00:27:26: want to check it out right now.

00:27:28: And yeah, regarding the offline and, and, and the web socket

00:27:31: stuff, this is really the future.

00:27:33: I think you might get some new stuff from the guy presenting tomorrow from

00:27:37: of the offline topic offline topic.

00:27:40: Right.

00:27:40: It's always.

00:27:41: a great thing to get some inspiration and always think about

00:27:45: what, what to do next, right?

00:27:47: So you can be a specialist in things that are already out there, or you can

00:27:52: just be the guy who was bringing out or the guy, the boy or the girl or whatever

00:27:57: to bring out the new stuff, right?

00:27:59: You have to explore, you have to do researching.

00:28:02: And as long as I'm into this, this topics, I will try to get offline.

00:28:07: into the Apex project or the Apex framework natively.

00:28:12: All right.

00:28:12: So I will ask you now some questions from our categories because we

00:28:17: are comparing our guests with the same questions and they are

00:28:22: separated in different categories.

00:28:23: So hypothetically in private and consumption, we will

00:28:27: start with hypothetically.

00:28:29: If you could undo one technological trend in the past, what would it be?

00:28:36: I would say it's I forget the name of the technology.

00:28:39: I apologize.

00:28:40: It's the distributed computing where people were doing like, I guess some,

00:28:46: some technologies like Netflix warrant having a thousand or a million servers.

00:28:51: But, and I guess I'm pretty biased being in it from an Apex perspective

00:28:55: and where it's all mostly one, one server, but I just think people.

00:28:59: get make technology too complicated.

00:29:02: For example, I was in the, in the first or second ever fusion applications

00:29:07: project was an on premise project and somebody showed me the architecture

00:29:11: diagram for fusion applications and I nearly fell off my chair.

00:29:15: I swear there was 50 boxes in that diagram.

00:29:18: Okay.

00:29:19: And, and, well, I still believe all of that could have been done in Apex.

00:29:23: Firmly believe that.

00:29:24: So, yeah.

00:29:25: It, it could be compared to co Kubernetes, right?

00:29:27: Yeah.

00:29:27: Or any modern microservices.

00:29:29: Mm-hmm.

00:29:30: Technology microservices.

00:29:31: Yeah, microservices.

00:29:32: I was guessing either it was microservices or, or Kubernetes.

00:29:36: So yeah, I, I read about that and I heard that I think Amazon went

00:29:40: back from a micro microservice structure back to a monolith mm-hmm.

00:29:44: and it was like, a couple of times faster to make it like this.

00:29:48: I think you should don't do it over complex, but I think there

00:29:51: are a couple of learnings, right?

00:29:52: Mm

00:29:53: hmm.

00:29:53: Yeah.

00:29:53: Complexity is the, I guess that's the word I would have used to get rid of complex

00:29:57: technology where it's not necessary.

00:29:59: That's

00:30:00: great.

00:30:00: So exactly the opposite of that.

00:30:03: Hypothetically, what would you like to invent or create in the technology sector?

00:30:08: I I'm very much.

00:30:10: Aside from APEX, I'm very interested in integrations.

00:30:13: So I'd like to create something that makes integrations easier.

00:30:16: I've had some thoughts about building I do a lot of stuff for the, I'd say

00:30:20: a quarter of my blog posts are about ORDS, about building some integration

00:30:24: technology with ORDS, because again, on the complexity side, I find too many

00:30:28: customers are using Oracle Integration Cloud when they don't really need it.

00:30:32: If you have APEX and ORDS, you essentially have an integration platform.

00:30:36: So I'd be interested in building something that could make That a bit more formal

00:30:41: for small to medium sized companies.

00:30:43: So

00:30:43: this sounds not like a concrete plan, right?

00:30:47: It's not hypothetically, it's what's in your in your queue.

00:30:50: Yeah,

00:30:51: I actually had a use case for it at a customer a few years ago,

00:30:55: and I've been thinking about it more recently since then.

00:31:00: I think you could just reach out to the community.

00:31:02: Because if you don't want to do it all by yourself, I know how much work you

00:31:06: can put in this as you can see in the flows for Apex project, for example,

00:31:10: if you open source that you will find great people from the community

00:31:13: having you with that topic, unless you want to do it like as a paid product.

00:31:17: But if it's just a contribution to the community, I wouldn't shoot, I wouldn't do

00:31:22: it alone because you get help from every single side, like oracles by themselves.

00:31:26: So that's a great idea.

00:31:28: Just to my five cents, right?

00:31:30: All right.

00:31:31: Another question from this category hypothetically what do you estimate

00:31:36: will be your daily life in 10 years?

00:31:41: Hopefully

00:31:41: it's exactly what it is now.

00:31:42: So it's about six or seven hours, heads down, coding, just getting into

00:31:47: stuff, writing, writing blogs, coding, couple of hours, hiking, getting

00:31:52: outside, spending time with my wife, sitting down, having a glass of wine.

00:31:58: at the end of the day.

00:32:00: But 20, 000 Twitter followers, right?

00:32:04: Well, I was very fortunate.

00:32:06: Adrian gave me an invite code to blue sky.

00:32:09: So I'm going to start trying that out now.

00:32:11: Oh, great.

00:32:12: Awesome.

00:32:12: So you're, you're hiking.

00:32:14: I heard that.

00:32:15: Did you went to the Rockies here?

00:32:16: Yeah, I have a friend

00:32:17: who lives here in Denver and he took me up there on Saturday.

00:32:21: Oh, great.

00:32:22: So we drove up to, well, didn't hike.

00:32:24: We drove up to 14, 000 feet, which I guess doesn't help very

00:32:27: much with the folks in Europe.

00:32:29: Yeah.

00:32:30: I'm from, from the UK originally, so we didn't convert very well either.

00:32:33: So my metric's not great.

00:32:35: Yeah.

00:32:36: That was the same as we are feeling like you have a jet lag and then you're

00:32:39: losing your breath for any reason.

00:32:42: During a presentation, it was pretty hard to, to stay, stay on

00:32:46: top of things because yeah, the, the air is with an eye, I guess.

00:32:50: And they told us not to go on the Rocky Mountains on the

00:32:53: first day when we arrive here.

00:32:55: And the funniest story is that we were in the plane and watching

00:32:59: like impatiently the screen to see when we are finally landing after

00:33:03: 10 hours of flight time, airtime.

00:33:06: And we saw the, the, the height.

00:33:11: Yeah.

00:33:11: The altitude on the screen.

00:33:12: And it, it was decreasing of course, because we were learning and we

00:33:17: said, okay, it's just 1, 600 meters.

00:33:20: And then what's happening right now.

00:33:24: And then it was reset to now.

00:33:26: And then we found out to no null zero.

00:33:28: Yeah.

00:33:29: We found out that.

00:33:29: Yeah, sure.

00:33:30: Denver's way higher than when we left off from Frank, from Frankfurt.

00:33:34: And we already noticed all the different things around.

00:33:37: Yeah, definitely.

00:33:38: Yeah.

00:33:38: And I noticed this now when the jet lag is way better than the last

00:33:41: days that I'm yeah, we're sitting in the ninth floor right now, it's

00:33:46: even higher than the normal thing.

00:33:48: And, yeah.

00:33:48: You have to adjust to that too, right?

00:33:51: Yeah.

00:33:51: I was going to make a joke in one of my presentations when I was at 14,

00:33:54: 000 feet, I checked my watch and my heart rate was 145 standing still.

00:33:59: And I was going to say, that's the only other time when I'm standing still, my

00:34:02: heart rate is 145 is when I'm standing in front of you guys or at 14, 000

00:34:06: feet, because I get quite nervous.

00:34:09: You're nervous, nervous when you're presenting, right?

00:34:11: Definitely.

00:34:12: Yeah.

00:34:13: Today was a bit better because I was in the same room and again, I got

00:34:16: more comfortable with the environment.

00:34:18: But yesterday, yeah, my heart rate was up there.

00:34:20: I was dry mouth.

00:34:22: Everything.

00:34:22: I think this will never go away.

00:34:24: No.

00:34:25: And it's good that it's like that.

00:34:27: I learned to know people who are not nervous at all when

00:34:30: they're going on the stage.

00:34:31: And I would say you hear it or you're you're getting it that that There's none.

00:34:37: Yeah.

00:34:37: Not so much passionate.

00:34:39: Right.

00:34:39: They say that in sports, right?

00:34:41: Like if, if, if you don't feel nerves and then you, you don't want it enough, right?

00:34:44: Yeah, exactly.

00:34:46: But nice to hear that.

00:34:47: Yeah, that another, another one, another presenters also,

00:34:51: so nervous before presenting.

00:34:53: All right.

00:34:53: So next category.

00:34:55: So we're in private now.

00:34:57: So are you satisfied with your work life parents currently?

00:35:00: Currently, yes, a year and a half ago, very much

00:35:03: no.

00:35:04: So what would be, I guess we already talked some of it, but what would be

00:35:10: one, one tip you would give someone who's exactly in the position you

00:35:14: were one and a half years ago?

00:35:16: Is to

00:35:16: ask, it never hurts to ask or to request to say, you know,

00:35:21: it's getting a bit much for me.

00:35:22: I need to be able to pull back because sometimes you just don't say it.

00:35:25: You just get overwhelmed by it and you let it get too much.

00:35:29: And what's the worst somebody can say is no, right?

00:35:31: Or, but maybe they'll understand

00:35:33: and so directly approach either your manager or your in

00:35:37: this case it was my business partners.

00:35:38: Yeah, yeah.

00:35:40: Okay, great.

00:35:41: All right.

00:35:41: So currently you are satisfied with your work life balance and

00:35:45: this will hopefully never change.

00:35:47: All right.

00:35:47: Next question.

00:35:48: Also from in private.

00:35:50: What role does your private environment play in your job?

00:35:52: Are you surrounded just by geeks and just yeah, going from job to geek

00:35:57: speech with your, with your friends?

00:35:59: So my wife is in, is a functional financials consultant for Oracle ERP.

00:36:04: So, you know, having been doing ERP implementations, so we trade off

00:36:09: ideas off each other, not technical, technical, but business ideas and what

00:36:15: might be useful to business folks.

00:36:17: So I find that very useful.

00:36:19: I think she finds it useful to understand the technology a little bit more.

00:36:23: But my friends are generally geeks, so it's, it's all geek talk there.

00:36:26: But, but, but my wife, I, I get to cover the business side a bit.

00:36:30: Yes.

00:36:30: Sometimes if you're just run by geeks and you're just talking,

00:36:34: talking about technical stuff, right?

00:36:36: Mm-hmm.

00:36:36: it, it's interesting, but it doesn't help you to shut off

00:36:39: your, your head after work, right?

00:36:41: Yeah.

00:36:41: So you have to be careful if it's.

00:36:44: Even if you're working not that much, but if you're still inside

00:36:48: your bubble all day every day, it could be, could be a problem.

00:36:52: But who am I to totally tell you here?

00:36:55: About that, but yeah.

00:36:56: All right.

00:36:57: So next question from in private, would you show us your screen

00:37:01: time on your iPhone or your cell phone without blushing?

00:37:06: Yeah, I think I would.

00:37:07: Yeah, I don't, I really don't do much, apart from Twitter and LinkedIn, I

00:37:12: don't do too much on my, my phone.

00:37:15: I read the news, but yeah, that's about it.

00:37:17: I'd be fine with that.

00:37:18: But it's always on every free second you get your phone out

00:37:22: and refresh the Twitter feed, or?

00:37:24: I'll

00:37:24: tell you what, that, that break I had helped with that.

00:37:27: Because I sat on the not literally on the beach every day for a month, but

00:37:31: most days and and it just sort of did a reset and I still do like when I posted

00:37:38: my slides this morning, I was curious to see if people were responding to that.

00:37:42: Yeah, but it's.

00:37:45: Maybe two, three times a day now, not two, three times an hour.

00:37:50: I remember that like a couple of hours ago when Philip was presenting, I took

00:37:54: a picture of the presentation and posted it on Twitter, and it doesn't take like

00:37:59: 30 seconds to get a like from Jonathan, so I was just guessing you might be more

00:38:04: active than you are saying right now.

00:38:06: Oh

00:38:06: yeah, actually you caught me out there.

00:38:08: At this conference, I have been looking more often.

00:38:10: I mean,

00:38:11: it's the greatest way.

00:38:12: It's, it's the greatest way because we are Twittering on the conference

00:38:16: in this bubble with a certain hashtag so you can follow everything online.

00:38:20: And yeah, it's one personal thing for me to share as much as possible from the

00:38:25: conference to get everyone on board and even for the people who are not attending

00:38:29: the conference to follow the stream and see what's happening right over here.

00:38:33: All right.

00:38:33: So, last category consumption.

00:38:36: How do you consume news and especially new knowledge?

00:38:40: Do you read newsletters, Twitter, books, magazines, or

00:38:43: even the Devs on Tape podcast?

00:38:46: News, I'm, like I said, I'm from the UK originally, so I have the BBC News app.

00:38:50: It's more or less the only news.

00:38:52: I have Apple News on my phone, so if I'm bored, I'll look at that.

00:38:56: But if I want to read the news, I'll look at the BBC.

00:38:58: For tech news, I, I, I...

00:39:00: I look at Tech Meme, it's a website that has a feed and the website so you

00:39:05: can get a newsletter for just general tech stuff like what's Microsoft doing,

00:39:10: what's Apple doing, what have you.

00:39:12: Everything, pretty much everything Apex or OZ related is from Twitter or LinkedIn.

00:39:18: What else?

00:39:19: That's about it really, that's, that's pretty much what I focus on for news.

00:39:23: Yeah, great.

00:39:24: So maybe kind of already answered from the consumption category, but how do

00:39:30: you deal with the growing flood of information via various channels, right?

00:39:33: So you said you have the BBC app on your phone, you have the

00:39:36: Apple News app, and that's it.

00:39:38: So I would not expect too many notifications from them during the day.

00:39:43: Yeah, I

00:39:43: don't have notifications.

00:39:44: I don't have notifications turned on for anything except for email.

00:39:48: Literally nothing.

00:39:49: So that, that, that helped me a lot.

00:39:51: That was a big thing.

00:39:52: So I, I decided when I look at my phone, obviously a phone call would

00:39:56: come through, but, and texts, so I guess I'm making exceptions already,

00:40:01: but like I don't have notifications on Twitter or LinkedIn or anything

00:40:04: like that.

00:40:05: I mean to have, to be able to be contacted.

00:40:09: It should be great.

00:40:10: So texting you calling you maybe DMS from, from, from social medias apps

00:40:15: should be okay in my opinion, because if someone tries to contact you directly,

00:40:21: it's almost the same like emails.

00:40:22: And it's not the same as when an app from a popular news outlet is

00:40:27: sending you the newest boyfriend news from one of the pop stars, right?

00:40:31: You should, correct.

00:40:32: Avoid that.

00:40:33: So, but I, I think that being reached is today something we are constantly in.

00:40:37: So everyone can reach us through various channels, but

00:40:41: you have to take care of that.

00:40:42: You're not flooded by information.

00:40:44: So your approach is just to disable everything and then

00:40:48: just enable those channels.

00:40:50: He will be reached

00:40:51: from and then I'll check on a regular basis.

00:40:53: So like you would most of the time you wouldn't expect to wait a day

00:40:58: more than a day for a response from me from like a Twitter DM for example.

00:41:02: Yeah.

00:41:02: Emails I'm more on it, especially in work.

00:41:05: I've, I'm an inbox zero guy.

00:41:07: So I I will hammer that inbox until there's nothing

00:41:10: there.

00:41:11: That was a question, a question which was in the categories before.

00:41:16: Inbox zero or inbox a hundred thousand.

00:41:19: Oh, I get, I get stressed out when I see the little red notification on

00:41:23: people's inboxes when they're presenting.

00:41:24: Yeah,

00:41:26: I'm always looking at that.

00:41:27: Yeah.

00:41:27: Right.

00:41:28: Yeah.

00:41:28: So inbox zero.

00:41:29: Wow.

00:41:30: There's nothing, nothing being held.

00:41:33: It's also a parking station.

00:41:35: It's also a privileged position because some people cannot physically

00:41:38: do that based on their role, too.

00:41:40: So

00:41:40: it's...

00:41:41: I mean, there is a way to archive emails or to put them away in folders.

00:41:46: So there are badges on the folder, but your inbox itself is zero

00:41:50: because you took care of that.

00:41:52: So that's the way I'm doing it.

00:41:53: So I have reminders that's coming back to me at a certain time when I'm thinking

00:41:58: that I can answer those questions or meet the requirements for that.

00:42:02: Inbox can be zero.

00:42:04: And that's there are sometimes I'm doing it again and again and again,

00:42:08: and then I lose track on that.

00:42:09: But I'm, I'm trying to reach the goal to have an inbox zero because of that

00:42:14: three mates, you always seeing them, you're always being tracking them.

00:42:18: What to do if you, if you have a hundred mates, those three or four

00:42:21: important mates are not visible anymore.

00:42:23: Right.

00:42:23: So you have to go through them.

00:42:24: So I had routes that are just sorting my emails away automatically.

00:42:29: And I had rules that are just prohibiting me from watching those,

00:42:34: those emails that are interesting, like go please newsletter folder inside the

00:42:38: newsletter folder, go on your own thing.

00:42:41: And I would just watch on the weekend or in the evening on this males, but

00:42:44: inbox zero at the end of the day is something I wish like four years now.

00:42:49: And it works.

00:42:51: For a week, but it's better than

00:42:53: nothing.

00:42:53: I just had an idea actually.

00:42:55: So I did my Microsoft integration demo this morning.

00:42:59: You could have a Microsoft integration to your email inbox and then use some AI

00:43:03: to detect where that email should really be, which folder it should go into.

00:43:08: This

00:43:08: is a very Very interesting approach because so for our listeners I'm

00:43:13: recording pretty much yeah, every day here at KSCO podcast episodes.

00:43:17: And I had to talk with one guy.

00:43:19: I will not include or yeah, I will not say it right now who

00:43:23: it was, but we talked about.

00:43:26: The same thing like not, not, not more than 30 minutes ago we were talking about

00:43:31: AI in Outlook because if someone puts your puts a double booking of your calendar.

00:43:39: There should be three emails deleted from the inbox as a, as a

00:43:43: sanction, and you should be able to reorganize your day by AI.

00:43:48: So which, which appointment is with important people who are

00:43:53: very, very hard to catch, right?

00:43:55: This should be staying on the same place.

00:43:57: But usually you are eating at one.

00:44:00: For example, then there should be a break and those meetings are better afternoon.

00:44:05: So you can yeah, concentrate on those things in this time.

00:44:08: And now you are telling me we can do an integration from like

00:44:12: apex to the, the office suite.

00:44:17: I think we should.

00:44:19: Come together on the table and find out what's the best way

00:44:21: to to find a solution on that.

00:44:23: So that sounds like a great idea to bring in Apex AI into the office.

00:44:27: Yeah.

00:44:28: Great.

00:44:28: In fact, I know an engineer at Microsoft and they might get beat us to it

00:44:33: cause they're putting in chat GBT into everything, everything they've got.

00:44:37: I saw a couple of beta tests showing that.

00:44:39: And I was seeing yesterday, the.

00:44:42: Apex office print guys from the United codes showing the demo,

00:44:45: like templating generated by AI.

00:44:47: I was a little bit frightened, but yeah, we will be covered with a very well

00:44:53: crusted texts in the future and we will never know who wrote them, but maybe we

00:44:59: all will get into reading more quality stuff because it's, yeah, I mean, it's

00:45:04: auto generated, but maybe we enhance our.

00:45:07: Way to read things.

00:45:08: Yeah,

00:45:08: on my blogs I use Grammarly.

00:45:10: Yeah.

00:45:11: Not to generate text, but, cause I'm, you know, I'm not that good at grammar

00:45:15: and I'm not, I'm not ashamed to say it, but I want people to read it and

00:45:19: not get distracted by the grammar.

00:45:20: Yeah.

00:45:20: So, yeah.

00:45:22: Same here for this podcast when I'm recording in English.

00:45:24: So there are a couple of occasions where I mean, many of the people are

00:45:28: just being angry about that, I think, but yeah, we are doing our best.

00:45:32: So, and if you are using Grammarly, I didn't see a service, which

00:45:36: is optimizing voice on podcasts.

00:45:37: So unless the service is coming out you and I mean, your listeners, you

00:45:42: should yeah, just take it as it is.

00:45:45: Perfect.

00:45:45: Great.

00:45:46: All right.

00:45:46: So I have another last question for you.

00:45:49: From the category consumption, do you turn off your cell phone at night?

00:45:53: So is it completely off grid then?

00:45:55: It's not off off, but it's set to that mode where only my

00:45:58: favorites would come through.

00:46:00: So, like, family, essentially.

00:46:02: Yeah, so emergency

00:46:03: regions regions we were just talking about.

00:46:06: All right, so.

00:46:07: I was very glad to have you here in my podcast or in our podcast.

00:46:10: Caro, unfortunately cannot be here in America, but she yeah, has a

00:46:14: couple of sessions in Germany.

00:46:16: You will hear them.

00:46:17: But yeah, I'm very great that you accepted my invitation to this podcast and I

00:46:21: yeah, I'm very happy to talk to you.

00:46:22: It was very inspiring for me to see that it is possible to, yeah, reach goals even

00:46:28: after You maybe said that this is nothing anymore for you, so you want to retire.

00:46:32: So this is some time ahead for me, but so it's basically just the thing of I wish

00:46:38: you had our a path you want to follow.

00:46:41: And you said, all right, I want to try that.

00:46:43: And.

00:46:45: Obviously you succeeded and that's a very inspiring thing and maybe we'll get some

00:46:50: open source software out in the future.

00:46:52: Yes.

00:46:53: And that's it.

00:46:54: Thank you.

00:46:55: Thank you very much, Jonathan.

00:46:56: Thank you,

00:46:56: Kai.

00:46:56: It was a privilege.

00:46:57: I really enjoyed

00:46:57: it.

00:46:58: And thank you to our listeners and yes.

00:47:01: See you soon.

00:47:01: Have a great conference, Jon.

00:47:03: Thank you.

00:47:03: And yeah.

00:47:04: Have a great time to our listeners.

00:47:06: Listen up in two weeks to the next episode of Devs on Tape.